Sunday, May 14, 2006

snob, pt. 2

and your point would be...?

14 comments:

Anonymous said...

"so to that commenter: you misunderstand. i didn't make the choices i made when i was a girl because i didn't want to be like the other girls; i didn't want to end up like them. i made those decisions because that future wasn't good enough to pay my debt".


I don't know what girls you are referring to, but that does not give anyone the reason to belittle, think they're superior because of education,riches , ethnicity or whatever anyone in this society deem as success.

Being a Snob means I'm so insecure about myself that I HAVE to put others down to make myself feel important. Think about the true meaning about racism.

I'm sure there is more to you then your education.

ding said...

there is a difference between saying that 'future' wasn't good enough and 'those girls' weren't good enough. and i'd never belittle those women i knew - and still know.

but let's not quibble about semantics; the larger context of what i said is that there *are* choices that are better than others. if we, as the african american community, don't begin to say that some things aren't good enough for us, our community will continue to die.

we have to start saying that the things that have been happening in our community aren't good enough - it's not good enough that our graduation rates are so low; it's not good enough that we have so many unwed mothers; it's not good enough that our kids have more of a chance to end up in prison than go to college - none of that is good enough.

now, how do we get here? we start by changing our communities - how we educate ourselves, how we make decisions about our lives. if other communities of color can say 'sorry, havng sub-standard public schools isn't good enough for my kids' then we should, too. and this isn't to say that we aren't. here in chicago, there are neighborhoods that are desperate to see their communities change and they're working for it and making their aldermen and reps work it for them.

but come on - calling me out on being a 'snob' when i'm saying that our black history doesn't deserve mediocrity?

please.

ding said...

Racism is the product of race prejudice coupled with institutional power.

Anonymous said...

Why do the strong want to overtake the weak and helpless?


A. Because they can.I have more so that makes me better.
B. The need to be stronger, no one ever told me I was good enough.
C. Ignorance.
D. People pleasers.
E. All of the above.

Talking about your community is fine, How do you fix the problem by ....

Anonymous said...

left this out-

who do you blame?

ding said...

blame.
that's funny.

who do you blame?

Anonymous said...

I noticed you said they were girls in your church. I am the last person to talk about church people, butttttt... The problem does start there. Granted, people choose to listen to what they want to from the pulpit and lets not forget those bible studies if they attend one, but, what happens when girls, yes girls turn out differently, who should we blame, the pastor, deacon board, parents? Or, does it all come to personal choice?

ding said...

gee, i grew up in a church where we did everything by the book - no one was divorced, everyone had a job, there was no sex before marriage, we had bible studies every week, our sermons from the pulpit were all full of fire and evangelical fervor, we didn't even believe in sex education or condoms.

we were the bestest fundamentalists EVER.

whatever could have been the problem?

but enough about me - who would you blame? (i always think this is the more interesting answer, especially when i suspect there's a really cool 'personal responsibility' rant to come that absolves any systemic problem whatsoever.)

Anonymous said...

Lol- well yeah somebody has to take blame. When I think about young people today, especially girls, its scary what they are up against these days. I wonder if the topics of sex is even talk about in youth groups, and if is, what is being told to young girls and boys. I need to check into that at my church. You seem to have grown up in a perfect enviroment :_). It's good that you chose to be different. I can only imagine what the pressures was like, especially since you didn't succumb to any of pressure that many teens face. Responsibility? With young people I would have to look at the parents. No matter how good the message coming from the pulpit, its still can go in one ear and out the other. It is so important that parents reinforce what is taught at church at home, don't you think so?

No Ding, minorities shouldn't settle for less. No one should. I wish there were more stronger women in churches to help along the weaker ones. I think older women stop ministering after awhile, not realizing they should be helping the younger women to become stronger for the kingdom. It seems like a lot things are twisted in churches. Men are taught to be strong and women? well...

ding said...

no one talked about sex in my church. no one. and when it was talked about, it was hysterically wrong about everything.

so if i had to 'blame' someone, i can think of two particular youth leaders (and they were married!) who were completely useless.

Anonymous said...

Married youth leaders??? Wow! that's deep. I don't blame you for blaming them. What did pastor think of them?

No one talk about sex? Are you pulling my leg? What did they talk about, holding hands and stuff like that? Not the lustful thoughts that boys and girls have?

ding said...

i think my church was fairly typical in that our conversations about sex and sexuality were limited to rules, prohibitions and misinformation. i was in college when they started having youth groups meet regularly and i was stunned at some of the honestly misinformed questions kids would have. (and what the implications of those questions were.)

and the response? 'well (cough) we don't really believe in all that so you'll have to pray about it.'

what the frack is that??

(but then again, i've always thought that basic religious sex education sucks.)

Anonymous said...

Ohhh. I see. I can see why it upsets you still to this day. Well, since you say you're a deacon, in the church where you are now, you now have a voice.

Sounds like people were covering their asses, for what they were doing. Those leaders were doing something wrong in their own lives ."If I doing what I doing, How can I tell a young person anything. Just pray about it". No wonder the christian community keep losing youth. Hopefully, those young people in your church are doing better, with minimum damage.

Do you think youth in the African American community are being affected by bad role models and absent fathers? I thought Bill Cosby comments were interesting about this. What did you think about what he said recently. A friend over at another blog emailed me something about his comments about women taking the lead in the home. What do you think of that. Is that the best solution for problems facing the AA community?

Anonymous said...

I meant to say this, regarding youth at church. That is why I said someone got to take the blame!

People usually don't.